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Author Topic: Concealed Carry  (Read 2033 times)

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jmdaniel

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Re: Concealed Carry
« Reply #15 on: March 07, 2010, 05:41:49 PM »

how many of you are willing to admit that you drink while you carrie?  I mean is bad enough we drink while we ride, but drink, ride and pack is too much for me.


Don't drink when I ride, don't pack.

Actually, come to think of it, I live in CenTex, so don't ride either!  :ohwow:
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hipshot

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Re: Concealed Carry
« Reply #16 on: March 07, 2010, 06:46:43 PM »

I have had mine for almost a year and what I have noticed is most places of business do not have the correct signs if they do not want you to carry in their place of business.If I am out on the bike may or may not carry depending on where I might stop for some refreshments lol.

You know, I've seen a number members of the lunatic right fringe advocating on various forums that if there is an error in form, punctuation, or verbiage in the signage posted by anti-CHL establishments, that CHL holders can disregard the signs and SHOULD do so. As a cop, as a CHL instructor, and as a person with no use for the lying, instigating lunatics at either far end of the political spectrum, I feel that I should offer my opinion on that stance:

The law states that businesses may bar CHL holders from carrying weapons on their premises. CHL holders who receive notification that carrying a firearm on such premises is prohibited by the owner (or owner's agent), and who do so anyway, are guilty of the offense of Criminal Trespass. The offense of Criminal Trespass is enhanced when one does so with a deadly weapon. Because the prostitutes (what y'all call attorneys) are constantly arguing abstract definitions and interpretations of the law to facilitate the results that their clients are paying for, any such notification must be defined by statute. The language required in the notification (which MUST be prominently displayed, to preclude antigun idiots from setting up CHL holders for unwarranted or malicious prosecution) is set forth in section 30.06 of the Texas Penal Code. Such signs are commonly referred to as (go figure......) 30.06 signs.

Now, one could argue (and some do) that the statute mandates specific criteria for the signs, and that if those critera are not met in their entirety, the signs are invalid and that a CHL holder may carry a weapon on the premises with immunity from arrest or prosecution. The following is the first part of TPC 30.05, which covers the offense of Criminal Trespass.
-------------------------------

Sec. 30.05. Criminal Trespass.
(a) A person commits an offense if he enters or remains on or in property, including an aircraft or
other vehicle, of another without effective consent or he enters or remains in a building of
another without effective consent and he:
(1) had notice that the entry was forbidden; or
(2) received notice to depart but failed to do so.
--------------------------------

So, while one could argue that the letters in the 30.06 sign were only 15/16" tall (30.06 requires that they be at least 1" tall) and therefore invalid according to 30.06, common sense would dictate that they would still satisfy the requirements of 30.05, i.e. notice that entry is forbidden to persons carrying firearms. I would caution CHL holders to be very careful about carrying where an ignorant property owner doesn't want you to. He/she may be misguided, but he/she has the right to prohibit carrying on his/her premises. Just because the sign is technically not in compliance with the statute, common sense would dictate that if you can read the sign you should respect the right. By all means, let the proprietor know that you are a law-abiding citizen who is not a threat to society, and that you intend to boycott his/her business as long as he/she continues to discriminate against good citizens who exercise their Constitutional right to legally arm themselves.

I haven't heard any of the Xriders I know advocate carrying in defiance of off-spec signs, but I hear the same arguments frequently: "So-and-so from (arfcom, chlforums, snipersparadise, glocktalk, etc., etc.) says it's legal and they can't arrest you."

I guess what I'm asking is that you consider the spirit of the law when the jailhouse lawyers start talking their sh1t. When Larry mentioned the signs, I thought about all the times I've heard the "sign's not legal so you can legally carry" argument. And when Morgan Buchanan mentioned the chlforums, I was reminded of all the times I've heard a CHL holder quote one of the chlforums members arguing the same thing. So please, use some common sense when you encounter those 30.06 signs, and try to see the issue from a neutral point of view.
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xcaliber

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Re: Concealed Carry
« Reply #17 on: March 08, 2010, 06:53:31 AM »

Common sense says " you may beat the charge, but you won't beat the ride." 
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bluestreak

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Re: Concealed Carry
« Reply #18 on: March 09, 2010, 03:54:44 PM »

Jim

Doesn't the "Castle" doctrin allow us to carry on the bike (as well as in a car) without having a CHL?
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SouthernXer

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Re: Concealed Carry
« Reply #19 on: March 09, 2010, 11:33:42 PM »

Jim

Doesn't the "Castle" doctrin allow us to carry on the bike (as well as in a car) without having a CHL?

I believe it is the Motorist Protection Act that allows that, not the Castle.
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hipshot

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Re: Concealed Carry
« Reply #20 on: March 10, 2010, 08:05:37 AM »

Jim

Doesn't the "Castle" doctrin allow us to carry on the bike (as well as in a car) without having a CHL?

A bunch of us have been asking that very question since the law was changed. None of the legal beagles have been able to give a definite answer. I think we'll have to wait for a test case to set a precedent. I wish I'd thought to bring it up when I was in Austin.
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xcaliber

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Re: Concealed Carry
« Reply #21 on: March 10, 2010, 04:31:01 PM »

last I heard the Harris county DA didnot agree with the TX supreme ct ruling and was looking for a test case. any volunteers?
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hipshot

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Re: Concealed Carry
« Reply #22 on: March 17, 2010, 08:48:07 AM »

Got a call this morning from a friend of mine at one of the federal agencies. Seems they got a new agent in the Houston office; she just got the warrant and was about to make her very first arrest. They knocked on the door and the turd's mama told her that he's dead. They checked it out and found out that he tried to carjack a CHL holder last week. He's a good boy now.................
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Noledad

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Re: Concealed Carry
« Reply #23 on: March 17, 2010, 03:51:19 PM »

Jim

Doesn't the "Castle" doctrin allow us to carry on the bike (as well as in a car) without having a CHL?

I believe it is the Motorist Protection Act that allows that, not the Castle.

Sometimes my tankbag might have something in it  ::)  but not if we might stop somewhere for a meal.  Without a CHL, I can't bring the tankbag inside with me and I'm too responsible to leave it outside unprotected.
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hipshot

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Re: Concealed Carry
« Reply #24 on: March 18, 2010, 07:00:23 AM »

"Without a CHL, I can't bring the tankbag inside with me and I'm too responsible to leave it outside unprotected."

Exactly.
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xcaliber

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Re: Concealed Carry
« Reply #25 on: March 18, 2010, 02:28:01 PM »

Jim

Doesn't the "Castle" doctrin allow us to carry on the bike (as well as in a car) without having a CHL?

I believe it is the Motorist Protection Act that allows that, not the Castle.

Sometimes my tankbag might have something in it  ::)  but not if we might stop somewhere for a meal.  Without a CHL, I can't bring the tankbag inside with me and I'm too responsible to leave it outside unprotected.
so get a chl or don't pack
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Morgan Buchanan

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Re: Concealed Carry
« Reply #26 on: March 20, 2010, 09:49:25 PM »

What Hipshot said...  there's a lot of info on the internet (which includes his advice) that MAY or MAY NOT be accurate.  Beating the rap doesn't necessarily make the hassle worth the trouble.  I MAY or MAY NOT get in trouble for walking past a non-compliant sign.  I do know for a fact that one of the lawyers who wrote the 30.06 legislation and works on gun rights legislation constantly says that one can do so and will eventually beat any charges.  But 1) I can't afford the lawyer to beat the charges and 2) I don't want to do business with someone who doesn't want me to do business with them.
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