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[Lone_Wolfe]

Uhm ... I'm new at this 

So I've ordered Barnett's new Springs ( and shims I think? HDL Part #: BTT-MT1146 ) to replace my existing clutch springs. 5th gear is slipping and it was suggested to try just replacing the springs first by a few folks and online forums.

Looking at the 2003 Service Manual for help ... where do the springs even go!? The lifter Plate? Am I going to have to remove not only the Clutch Cover, but the Timing Cover, and the Crankcase Cover as well? And my pipes as well I imagine!?

I know I'll get some help in a couple weeks at Tech Day... so my question is what should I be prepared for?
I suppose I'll need to buy a new Crank Case Seal if that comes off along with the Clutch cover.
Is there a Clutch Cover gasket? Timing Cover gasket?
New exhaust gaskets to buy if the pipes come off.
Do I have to drain the engine oil ahead of time? So buy new oil and filter? Not that it needs changed at this time.

Anything else you guys can point out from your experiences? They tell me it's an easy thing to do. When I do this in a couple weeks I'm wanting to have everything I might need at hand.

Thanks!

LW

[Morgan Buchanan]

http://bareasschoppers.com/clutchspring/  nothing could be easier.  Well ok, it could be easier...  but this is pretty easy.  Just a couple things from my observation.

1)  If you plan on doing it with oil in the engine, you have to do it on the side stand.
2)  Bare's suggestion for how to remove the actual engine case is off.  If you feel along the lower left side of the clutch case (as you face it from the clutch side of the bike) you'll feel a tab.  You can access that tab with a dowell from the other side of the bike.  Put a dowel on that tab and hit it with a hammer.  Have someone ready to catch the cover.
3)  I tightened my spring bolts with a clicker type torque wrench.  I've read horror stories of people breaking those stock bolts off.  They torque down to 9 pounds, and a lot of people really suggest using a good low-range deflector torque wrench.  Just fair waringing, just because it worked for me doesn't mean it'll work for you.  The next time I do this work I'm going to order a set of Big Larry's high strength bolts.

[hipshot]

Lone_Wolfe, call me. 281/389-2921.

Jim

[Morgan Buchanan]

Hey Jim, if you have tips or tricks that you wouldn't mind sharing (or if you think my observations were off) I'd sure like to hear it... Always looking to improve what I do.

[Lanky]

I replaced my springs and it helped some but it still slips if I get on it hard. If you run the tires up on a 2x6 and then let it lean on the side stand you won't loose much oil.

Greg

[hipshot]

Hey Jim, if you have tips or tricks that you wouldn't mind sharing (or if you think my observations were off) I'd sure like to hear it... Always looking to improve what I do.

I just didn't have time to type a long post covering everything; I figured it'd be quicker to answer any questions direct.

[Lone_Wolfe]

Thanks Jim, Morgan! I got your numbers and I'll be yack'n at ya both soon. 

[hipshot]

Okay, I have a little time here to offer some things I've learned. First of all, you will need to pull your pipes. On Retros you don't normally have to (some exhaust systems differ), but the wraparound pipes on the C make it necessary. So get new gaskets. I have done clutch work with the wheels up on blocks and the bike leaning WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY over on the sidestand. It worked. However, it scares the hell out of me to put all that trust in that little itty bitty sidestand bolt, and the whole time I was working on it I doubt you could have driven a needle up my butt with a 12-pound sledge hammer. It's cheaper to replace some oil than to repair the bike because the sidestand let go. Depending on your mileage, you may not need to replace the filter; just the oil.

You don't need to torque the spring bolts. You aren't torquing against the springs; you are bottoming out the bolts in the taps and torquing against the bottom of the tap. You can "feel" the bolts tighten into the bottom of the tap, and you just need to get them snug enough to preclude their backing out. If you do torque them, use a deflector beam wrench, as Morgan recommended, or use an inch-pound wrench if you prefer a 'clicker' wrench. I snapped one off seven threads in on Vernell's bike, and by the time I got that @*&^%@# piece of bolt out of there I had broadened our vocabularies significantly.

You can use Honda Bond to reseal the covers if you are a member of the affluent society. If you're like the rest of us, go to WallyWorld and grab a tube of RTV sealer; I generally use the Permatex Ultra Black high temperature RTV silicone, but lots of others will work. Go very sparingly when you put down your bead, and after it sets up you will see a bit of it poking out if the seam. Just roll it off with your finger.

You will need to remove the clutch cover and the crankcase cover. I have a cardboard box with the bolt pattern drawn out on it and holes punched through it for the bolts. Since you are dealing with different length bolts, this will keep them organized; just shove them in the appropriate hole as you remove them.

A lot of folks have resolved clutch slipping issues with a simple spring swap, or shimming the springs, or both. The 1800 uses the same springs as the 1300, and they are arguably marginal for the 1800's torque. Some folks have been plagued with clutch problems, and have gone through several sets of springs and new clutches without resolving the problem. I started getting a tiny bit of slip at a little over 20k miles. I installed a set of Barnett springs and it hasn't slipped since, with nearly 30k on the springs.  One caveat... even if you drain the oil before you pop the covers, you will get a fair amount of oil (a cupful or so) running out when the crankcase cover comes off, so be ready if you don't want to work in an oil puddle. Call me if you have any specific questions. I'm going to try to make it to your tech session, but if (and that's a big if) I can make it I won't be there much before noon.

[RedDragon]

First of all, you will need to pull your pipes.

I don't think that will be his first step Jim! 

[hipshot]

First of all, you will need to pull your pipes.

I don't think that will be his first step Jim! 

And my pipes as well I imagine!?

Hey, I answered his question Now, can I have a medium rare ribeye?

[Chad]

Sent ya a PM!! 

[Luckys Lover]

You will need to remove the clutch cover and the crankcase cover. I have a cardboard box with the bolt pattern drawn out on it and holes punched through it for the bolts. Since you are dealing with different length bolts, this will keep them organized; just shove them in the appropriate hole as you remove them.

Just go to the back of the wife's closest and grab a shoe box. Use the bottom for one outline and the lid for a different one.  Just don't let the wife see you get the box. 

[hipshot]

And make double-damned sure you take the shoes out first.............................

[Morgan Buchanan]

Because a shoe could be useful to catch that oil that drops when you pop the engine case?  LOL

[DAR-Silver Surfer]

When I replaced my springs I also replaced the clutch plates. It only takes a couple of min. more. and in my opinion worth it.  I've had no slip since.